Author Topic: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut  (Read 565 times)

Darius1968

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Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« on: September 05, 2021, 04:58:53 AM »
I'm obviously in the market for a new monitor.  It would be ideal, if I can replace my 32" Samsung, with another 32" option, but I can settle for a 27", to fit my budget, which is USD $350-$450, but I'm willing to possibly, consider options that are a little bit above that. 

Specifically, I'm interested in something that has a wide color gamut, is 4K, with an IPS panel.  As I'm mostly interested in the best "bang for buck", in terms of color fidelity, and dynamic range, things that interest gamers:  ie., refresh rates, and the like, aren't as important to me. 

I know this question is not totally on topic, with this forum, but I'm sure it is of interest to others here, and I greatly appreciate any and all input!  Also, I do appreciate, in addition to the mentions of specific makes and models, elsewhere-forums that might be relevant to my quest. 

Thanks! 

sinus

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #1 on: September 05, 2021, 10:10:46 AM »
Darius,
I  have no answer or hint, sorry.
Recently I bougth a new one, for the studio, but to be honest (I am at home now), I do not know the name.  :-[

That brings me to my personal thoughts about monitors. Some years ago I bought monitos from Eizo, because they were famous for good colors and color-ranges.
And they were very expensive.
And I did a lot of RGB-stuff, like Adobe RGB, ECI, srRG and so on to catch the best color-RGB-spectrum, and I did monitor - calibration with spider and other stuff.
A lot of money and a lot of time.

But I have lerned (for me, mind), that most professional collegues (photographers) and even more professional graphic artists, they don't even care.
They have a RGB-range, with what they work, and do all convert with one button.
Calibration? Nope. Check images with e.g. 5500 Kelvin? Nope.
Working in a good lighting environment? Nope, depends on random.

Of course they are some exceptions, like always in the life, but these artists or "perfect" people are seldom.

Nowadays I do not more look for RGB. I go with Adobe RGB and that's it.
I do also no more calibration. Instead I have some pictures, where I do check the brightness and colors and change maybe something, if necessary.

What I do not: I do never buy smaller monitors, as I have now. It would be a step back, and for me frustrating.
I do work with two monitors, because that is cool, very cool, specially with soft software like IMatch, you can have panels on one monitor, and the main stuff on the other. Also with photoshop. Really cool.
The only issue here: My two monitors have different resolution, and this is not good. You can enlarge the fonts by windows or in the software itself, you have usually some problems.
In IMatch some problems Mario solved with some preferences for "bigger icons", as an example. But there are nevertheless some problems, like in the file-window for text or Design and Print.
But such problems I have also with photoshop, or Cura-slicer, InDesign or Blender. Hence this is generally a problem and I would solve it with two monitors with the same resolution (not necessaraly with the same size).

On thing I have not tried to replace two monitors with one: the very wide monitors, what are in fact, if you would cut it in the vertical middle, two monitors.
I do not know, if these kind of monitors are a good thing to use.








Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

Jingo

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #2 on: September 05, 2021, 03:00:23 PM »
I agree with Markus - unless you are producing images professionally for a printer, gallery or need color accuracy (and in that case, Eizo is your friend) - just get a monitor that has good reviews and fits your budget.

I've been very happy with my widescreen LG ... if I were buying today in that price range, I'd probably be looking at the LG Ultragear series...  Good luck!

kirk

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2021, 04:26:55 PM »
Instead of wasting money on generally  expensive wide gamut monitor  I would rather buy any cheap IPS  + X-rite colorimeter.
Colormonkey  or whatever they call it now.

With colormeter  any monitor turns  just ok and perfect  and you doesn't have to torture you with right vs wrong choice.   it even might be cheaper combined.

Mario

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2021, 04:32:03 PM »
There is also the DataColor Spyder series for monitor calibration, which works well and is, more or less, affordable.

Darius1968

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2021, 05:09:50 AM »
Kirk, correct me, if I'm wrong.  I know what calibration is all about.  But, would the colorimeter actually extend an sRGB monitor into an Adobe sRGB one?  My understanding is that it wouldn't. 

thrinn

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2021, 09:47:47 AM »
Kirk, correct me, if I'm wrong.  I know what calibration is all about.  But, would the colorimeter actually extend an sRGB monitor into an Adobe sRGB one?  My understanding is that it wouldn't.
The colorimeter can not extend the physical capabilities of the monitor. I think Kirk wanted to question if Darius really needs a Wide Gamut display - or if sRGB would be sufficient for his needs. I am no pro, so I am happy with a sRGB based workflow.
Thorsten
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sinus

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2021, 11:53:44 AM »
Kirk, correct me, if I'm wrong.  I know what calibration is all about.  But, would the colorimeter actually extend an sRGB monitor into an Adobe sRGB one?  My understanding is that it wouldn't.
The colorimeter can not extend the physical capabilities of the monitor. I think Kirk wanted to question if Darius really needs a Wide Gamut display - or if sRGB would be sufficient for his needs. I am no pro, so I am happy with a sRGB based workflow.

And about professionals:
I would wonder, how many professionals (what live from images, roughly seen) do really work, like they should theoretically, with calibration regularly.
I work with graphic designer, mostly for press and adverts and so on, I have never seen someone work with it really.
If, then they use it one or two times, and then they let it be.

So did I. I used several spiders, always the same, I really did not use it for others. And only to know, my monitors are calibrated correct, it was not enough.
And by the way, if you want really do it correct, that is not that easy.

And you have to do it regulary, from time to time. And you have to look on the light from windows, lamps and so on.
I think, the guys, who does this really correct and seriously, are very, very rare.
But they are such guys around, for sure.

And btw, your impression of the colours changes in the course of the day, Kodak used to do a lot of elaborate studies, e.g. with their lab assistants it even depended on what they had eaten for breakfast.
Women have a better judgement of colours anyway (I think this has been proven, but I don't have any sources).

And then you calibrate your monitor elaborately and often to see how the graphic artist converts such a picture into an sRGB or Adobe profile at the push of a button, and maybe says "hmm, it's a bit too little atmosphere for me, I'll add some red" ...

Or a colleague looks at such a picture on his laptop in the restaurant and says "great picture, a bit dark, but otherwise top" ...

Nope, I no longer calibrate, neither with a colourimeter nor with anything else.
I have some test-files with colors, CMYK, RGB, greytones and so on, and look at them on my monitors and let print them from time to time on books and professional print-studios, to see, if the differences from my decision and montors to the printed stuff is still ok. (btw, you will almost never get the same result from prints from different companies, only this alone should make you think about "is it really necessary").

And think meanwhile, even sRGB is ok.  8) (I work with ECI-RGB or Adobe)
Sorry for my long post, but this stuff makes me a bit upset, because in the past I used really a lot of time for this "color-stuff", hired twice even two consultants, what works only with this science (one is a well-known professor in Switzerland), but after all, from my experience today: for almost nothing.  :-X
 
Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

Darius1968

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2021, 12:12:39 PM »
A question that just now popped into my head, that maybe, someone can answer - About OLED TVs: 
OLED TVs are nowadays renowned for their vibrancy and high-dynamic-range.  But, does this necessarily mean that they are performing at or near 100%, with respect to the Adobe RGB and DCI-P3 color spaces, or are they still, nonetheless, functioning within the sRGB color space only? 
« Last Edit: September 21, 2021, 12:15:18 PM by Darius1968 »

kirk

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2021, 06:57:08 PM »
The colorimeter can't extend the physical capabilities of  screen.  It's only purpose to do accurate colors on your scre en. not cool or great looking, just accurate.    If  you do something for hire  I can't imagine how  could you work without calibrating.   You risk to make under or over contrast colors , have a color shift etc.     
Some people  believe  they know what right colors are with just a test picture.   I had been one of them   gradually accepting  subtly shifting screen till once discovered  how strongly off it have actually gone.     That seriously  shattered my self believe ha-ha :)     And I learned never trust your own perception  100%    Iit could be deceptive.     That said  colorimeters can go off too.  Their sensors  are aging   so  after 10 years you need a new one basically.

As of sRGB  vs Adobe or any wide gamut.     The difference between gamuts  is in super vivid, super saturated  colors only . You hardly find such colors in a regular photo.     Yeah, you cant' see  some neon/asid colors it it's full nuke saturation  . Like that purple diod light  or some insane green/emerald colors  and what?    I assume some  pro folk  need those nuke colors  rendered correctly  but  I bet most people doesn't.

 It's same with HDR  screens with nuke brightness. They are cool to stare once and make your eyes blind.  Not for tweaking nuances or do any work in general.





« Last Edit: September 21, 2021, 07:06:27 PM by kirk »

spiff

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2021, 04:44:22 PM »
I think 4K is a bit much for just 27". I would consider to use 32". hardware callibration is better than software callibration. An Eizo will cost thousands if you want that. The BenQ SW321C 81 is much cheaper and with good recommendation at prad.de and Amazon reviews.

spiff

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2021, 04:54:01 PM »
That said  colorimeters can go off too.  Their sensors  are aging   so  after 10 years you need a new one basically.

Yes. Everyone is buying a colorimeter and expects it is a Urmeter. But it is not, it is subjected to calendar aging as the monitor does allone trough time. Maybe you try to calibrate a shifted monitor with a shifted colorimeter. This is why at industry a torque wrench (the colorimeter) needs an adjustment (and not a callibration) from time to time.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2021, 04:58:27 PM by spiff »

spiff

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2021, 05:42:55 PM »
....And think meanwhile, even sRGB is ok.  8) (I work with ECI-RGB or Adobe)

Yes, this is what i decided years ago as a hobby photographer. My tipp is always choose a Monitor with a very precise integrated S-RGB Modus (see at prad.de). If you can do without Adobe RGB and work with S-RGB there is no stumbling stone left in whole process.

i find this reading helpful:
https://fotovideotec.de/farbmanagement/index.html

Darius1968

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Re: Display Monitor Options: 4K, 27", IPS, Wide Gamut
« Reply #13 on: October 13, 2021, 12:23:39 PM »
Thanks, for the link, spiff.