Author Topic: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct  (Read 1029 times)

sinus

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Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« on: July 16, 2020, 02:06:50 PM »
I had this error now, say, every week once, and I work every day with IMatch.
Means not that important and I can it everytime repair, hence not very bad.
Though a bit "grrmmlllgrrr".  ;D

I have described it also here
https://www.photools.com/community/index.php?topic=10386.msg73900#msg73900

and today again with a probper log in debug-modus.

My category formula, what works really since years, and I have not changed it since years.

I work with IMatch, in this case I edited tifs in Photoshop, dragĀ“n drop from IMatch.
I do this really almost every day.

I work in a category with some formulas.
IMatch is not slow, no problems, but suddenly the thumbs are gone, and the category shows an error.
I work with a image in PS and let IMatch open. Usually no problems. I do this since years, work always.

But maybe, if IMatch update the images, this happens now since some versions, I do not know, since when.
I would guess, since 3-4 monthes, but can also be since 5-6 monthes, unfortunately I do not know this.

To solve this, I have simply to open the formula - editor, do nothing change, simply hit ok and all is fine again.
Means, the formula itself should be ok.
And though I have a lot of images and quite a lot of categories, I do not believe, that this has something to do with this.

It must have a change in some of the latest versions or maybe since IMatch2020.
But this I do not know.

Mario, as I pointed out, nothing what is important or does hurry, I wanted only now create a bug-report, what you have also proposed in your answer in my first post, what I have linked above.

Now I have attached some pics and the log.
Maybe you have an idea. If not now, maybe in some weeks or monthes.  ;D

Thanks for listening.




« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 02:08:54 PM by sinus »
Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #1 on: July 16, 2020, 02:39:46 PM »
I have seen this same problem a few times, not often though.  And sometimes the formula category works as it should but the parent category, which is just a regular category and not a formula, will show an error.

When a formula category has an error doing just what Markus said fixes it.

When the parent normal category shows an error I've had to create a new parent category and move the formula subcategory to it.

sinus

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #2 on: July 16, 2020, 02:43:36 PM »
Ah, thanks John, for your input.

What I have forgotten to mention, it is of course not only this formula, what I have showed in the attachement.
Sometimes other formulas does also show the same behaviour.
Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #3 on: July 16, 2020, 02:50:10 PM »
Same here Markus.  It could be any of my formula categories that have worked for years which suddenly show a problem.

But as also mentioned, for me this doesn't happen often, maybe once a month.

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #4 on: July 16, 2020, 02:53:52 PM »
Sometimes some of your complex formula-based categories show an error.
I could not see any warnings or errors in your log file - except one when extracting a thumbnail. Nothing harmful.

Your formula uses a large number of collections. All collections are calculated dynamically on-demand, whenever something changes in the database and the collection is requested by some feature in IMatch.
This means when you make IMatch busy (as you did in this session with indexing files) and IMatch has to update all the collections all the time and your formula-based category wants to update but the collections are not yet ready, the formula may show "old" results, and then update as soon as all collections used in your formula (6! in total).

Especially the collections based on file relations are really expensive. They are completely invalidated when files are added and updated. And when the collection is requested, the relation manager needs to rescan the folder to determine which versions there are. And, depending on how you use these categories, this may happen hundreds of times while IMatch is processing files in the background. This puts a lot of pressure on the entire system. Maybe something gives in and one of the collection tells the formula "failure"... should not happen, but such a complex category formula with so many expensive collections is a bit unusual.

If you click into the Category View and press <F5> to refresh it, does the problem go away?
If not, does it go away when IMatch has finished processing files in the background? Maybe after pressing F5 then?
How many of such formula-based categories do you have?
Are all using collections? Or also other expensive objects?
Does this only happen when you index files in the background?

Not sure where should even start searching without a bit more info.

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #5 on: July 16, 2020, 02:54:16 PM »
Same here Markus.  It could be any of my formula categories that have worked for years which suddenly show a problem.

But as also mentioned, for me this doesn't happen often, maybe once a month.

Show some examples of your formulas.

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #6 on: July 16, 2020, 03:16:37 PM »
Mario you described my situation.  Now that I think about it the last time I had this problem it involved collections.

I have a parent category called Today, it's just a regular category.  under it I have two more regular categories, one is named New, the other is named Updated.

Under each of those are two formula categories that show new images added to the database today and images that have been updated today.

Here are the formulas.

New original images added today
Code: [Select]
"@RFolder[file://D:/Mine/Photos/Years/]" AND "@Collection[Added|Today]" AND ("@FileRegExp[\.dng$]" OR "@FileRegExp[\.tif$]" OR "@FileRegExp[\.cr2$]")
New JPGs (versions) added today
Code: [Select]
"@RFolder[file://D:/Mine/Photos/Years/]" AND "@Collection[Added|Today]" AND "@Collection[Relations|Version]"
Master images updated today
Code: [Select]
"@Collection[Updated|Today]" AND "@RFolder[file://D:/Mine/Photos/Years/]" AND "@Collection[Relations|Master]"
Version images updated today
Code: [Select]
"@Collection[Updated|Today]" AND "@RFolder[file://D:/Mine/Photos/Years/]" AND "@Collection[Relations|Version]"


Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #7 on: July 16, 2020, 03:46:37 PM »
@sinus:

Please also copy/paste your formulas into a reply.

sinus

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #8 on: July 16, 2020, 04:20:23 PM »
@sinus:

Please also copy/paste your formulas into a reply.

Good idea, here some category-formulas:

this is often affected (I believe also today, with log)
("@Collection[Relations|Version|NEF Versioning]"OR "@Collection[Relations|Version|JPG-als-master]") AND "@Collection[Bookmarks]" AND"@Collection[Flags|On]" AND "@Collection[Pins|Red]" AND "@Collection[Dots|None]"

this is often affected (I believe also today, with log)
"@Collection[Bookmarks]" AND "@Collection[Flags|On]" AND "@Collection[Pins|Red]" AND "@Collection[Pins|Blue]" AND "@Collection[Dots|None]"

this here is not that often wrong, but from time to time also:
"@Collection[Bookmarks]" AND ("@Collection[Dots|Red]" OR "@Collection[Dots|Green]" OR "@Collection[Dots|Blue]")

and this here, but also not often wrong:
"@Collection[Bookmarks]" AND "@Collection[Flags|On]" AND "@Collection[Pins|Red]" AND "@Collection[Dots|None]"

And a whole bunch I deleted last week, because I used them not often anyway and was a bit sick of it.
8)

Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2020, 10:40:01 AM »
I've added categories for all formulas provided by Carl and sinus to two of my database (a smaller and a big 200,000 files database).
I've also added more logging in case a formula is not resolving or a collection is not found. So far, no errors or flagged categories.

The log file attached by sinus did not show any warnings related to categories.
But there is logging in case a formula fails to resolve. Maybe when it happens on your computer again you can check the log for W> in relation to categories.

sinus

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2020, 10:50:13 AM »
I've added categories for all formulas provided by Carl and sinus to two of my database (a smaller and a big 200,000 files database).
I've also added more logging in case a formula is not resolving or a collection is not found. So far, no errors or flagged categories.

The log file attached by sinus did not show any warnings related to categories.
But there is logging in case a formula fails to resolve. Maybe when it happens on your computer again you can check the log for W> in relation to categories.

Thanks, Mario
this is fine.
I will do so and "have an eye" on this issue.
Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #11 on: July 22, 2020, 09:09:00 AM »
3 days, no formula errors so far...
Seems to be another of these hard go grab random errors. Maybe a timing issue or something.

I have added some additional logging so if it happens again on your systems we should get some better info in the log, hopefully.

sinus

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2020, 09:39:51 AM »
3 days, no formula errors so far...
Seems to be another of these hard go grab random errors. Maybe a timing issue or something.

I have added some additional logging so if it happens again on your systems we should get some better info in the log, hopefully.

Thanks, Mario, that is very good.
Hopefully we can get on the ground with your additional logging.

Seems to be really randomly, but quite often now.
But fortunately nothing bad at all.
Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

sinus

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #13 on: July 28, 2020, 03:09:02 PM »
Hi Mario
Just now I had this again, and this time with so many formulas like never.
But this time I had debug-log on, maybe this helps.
And with the newest Version.

All was fine.
Then I let import about 300 images or so new from a folder (all nefs)
Then I changed to categories and a lot of formulas where wrong, showed 0, see attachement 1.

Then I clicked in the first formula, here:
"@RFolder[file://F:/Archiv-SINUS-AKTUELL/00_timeline-aktuell/_neu von card/]" AND "@Collection[Added|Today]"
(is in the cat "A HEUTE NEU Import-Ordner")

And did nothing change, simply hit ok ... bang, ALL categories with formulas are ok again (attach 2)

Attached also the log.

Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #14 on: July 28, 2020, 03:27:56 PM »
I see several warnings about invalid file ids from the sorter. This usually means that it attempts to sort non-existing files, e.g. while you are deleting files from the file window.
Nothing harmful, but maybe an indicator.

None of the new warnings I have added for category formulas have been triggered. Which means that the category error is not causes by the collection formulas. Maybe by something else.
Your category formulas refer to many collections, including collections which are updating when you add files. Basically, each of your formulas will be recalculated several hundred times while you index files - because each new or updated files causes all collections to become invalid, and all categories too. It is likely that your formulas somehow fail because of this - because some categories or collections are currently in an intermediate state when the category with the formula must be updated. Which can happen hundreds of times during a scan. For each of your categories...!

I cannot see any problems related to categories or collections in the attached log file.
I could also not reproduce the problem so far in my database, using your formulas and the Carl's combined.
I can only add more logging code in the hope to figure out which of your category formulas breaks your setup and why.

sinus

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #15 on: July 28, 2020, 04:15:26 PM »
Thanks Mario

Finally it is nothing important or serious bad thing.
If it occurs more often, and we cannot find the reason, ok, not that bad.
I will then create another way of workflow, though this one has worked without changing for years.

But IMatch give us a lot of possibilities, fortunately.  :D
Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #16 on: July 28, 2020, 04:32:28 PM »
I have no idea what could have changed to cause this.
And i have never seen this here. I run your formulas for over a week now, with two databases.

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #17 on: September 22, 2020, 01:55:09 AM »
I have one more thing to add to this.
I had noticed the formula category errors seem to come and go.
Meaning I may not see any errors for several days and then I may see the problem several times during a single day.

It seems this problem occurs quite often while I am reprocessing existing raws (usually DNGs in my case) in an external program then exporting the optimized JPGs back to the database to replace the original JPG versions.

That's what I've been doing today, sending old existing raw images to PhotoLab and Affinity Photo then exporting the optimized JPGs back to my IMatch database.  And 5 times today I've had to correct formula category errors.  Which is always easy to do, I just click to edit the formula then without changing anything I'll click ok and the errors all disappear.

Mario I don't know if this will help you track down this problem but I thought I'd mention it.

sinus

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #18 on: September 22, 2020, 08:26:23 AM »


It seems this problem occurs quite often while I am reprocessing existing raws (usually DNGs in my case) in an external program then exporting the optimized JPGs back to the database to replace the original JPG versions.
 

This is interesting, John.
Because if I think about this, that is very often the case here.
Almost always the behaviour does occur, if I "develop" Raws (nef in my case) and store then the created jpgs into DB.
And then I do optimize these jpgs and replace the before created jpgs in the DBs.

Could be really a good hint.
Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #19 on: September 22, 2020, 08:56:49 AM »
Log file in DEBUG MODE from a session where you experienced this?
See log file

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #20 on: September 22, 2020, 07:41:19 PM »
Attached is the log from today when I had IMatch 2020.9.4 in debug mode.

After exporting some reoptimized JPGs to replace existing JPG versions in my database then refreshing all data-driven categories I had one non formula category with an error indicator.  This my Updated Today parent category that has 2 formula subcategories named Masters and Versions.

The 2 formula subcategories seemed to be ok, just the parent standard category had the error this time.

Same fix as usual solved it, edit and save.

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #21 on: September 22, 2020, 08:08:33 PM »
I see

Quote
Exception (...) while calculating category '!Today' [1439368]

which indicates that IMatch handles an internal error, caused by an unknown reason.
This happened while IMatch was alsp busy writing/propagating  metadata back into files, reading metadata from files (which also updates the database and invalidates categories), launching new ExifTool instances, Updating file relations, dealing with ExifTool warnings about incorrect namespaces in XMP produced by Microsoft, updating collections, and running searches ? via the search engine with an empty search string, multiple times?

Might be a timing issue. Pure coincidence. An exceptional situation caused just by the combination of all that was going on at that time in your database (lots!).
Since the calculation of the category failed and even failed with raising an exception, IMatch probably flagged it as "in error".
This is not a permanent state. Closing and re-opening the database (or restarting IMatch) resets this state back to normal.

IMatch also reports that your !Checks category is very slow. Nothing harmful, just something that may slow down IMatch (this is logged when a category takes more than 5s to update).

I recall having imported your and sinus' categories in a mid-size (150K) test database. I use this database almost every day, but so far no category ever reported a problem.
« Last Edit: September 22, 2020, 08:23:42 PM by Mario »

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #22 on: September 22, 2020, 08:18:38 PM »
Thanks Mario.  The next time I see a category error I'll see what happens when I close and reopen the database, I don't recall doing that before.

My !Checks category that is so slow is the category that I'm hoping to eliminate in the future.  It has several formula subcategories which return the images with specific metadata missing.

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #23 on: September 22, 2020, 08:28:49 PM »
This error will be very hard to reproduce. Maybe I can add some additional logging code.

Was it this formula that failed`?

"@RFolder[file://D:/Mine/Photos/Years/]" AND "@Collection[Added|Today]" AND ("@FileRegExp[\.dng$]" OR "@FileRegExp[\.tif$]" OR "@FileRegExp[\.cr2$]")
« Last Edit: September 22, 2020, 08:37:25 PM by Mario »

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #24 on: September 22, 2020, 09:35:14 PM »
That one has had errors occasionally too but not today so far.

Today the following formulas are in subcategories of the category that had the error

"@Collection[Updated|Today]" AND "@RFolder[file://D:/Mine/Photos/Years/]" AND "@Collection[Relations|Master]"

"@Collection[Updated|Today]" AND "@RFolder[file://D:/Mine/Photos/Years/]" AND "@Collection[Relations|Version]"

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #25 on: October 11, 2020, 11:26:18 AM »
I think I might have identified the potential reason for this sporadic problem  :)
Under some rather obscure conditions, category formulas could try to access dynamic collections (like children of "Label",  "Viewed", etc.) and this did not cause the parent collection to recalculate.

Dynamic collections like Labels dynamically create their child categories from metadata in the database. In case of Label, this means for all unique label names found in the metadata of all files. Before this has been done, the Label root category has no children. And hence a formula asking for "Label|Red" will fail, causing the category to be in error. This should not happen, of course. IMatch should recalculate the collection before checking for the children.

Since calculating child categories for collections can be 'expensive' (aka slow), IMatch postpones these calculations until the children are needed. For example, if the "Label" collection is collapsed in the collection view, there is no need to calculate the children. Only when a user expands the Label node, the children are calculated / updated.

For other access, like formulas or IMWS endpoints (apps), the IMatch engine calculates the collections when they are first accessed.
While working on a new feature app for IMatch 2021, I've identified an issue with this automatic re-calculation, which finally lead to the bug fix.
I'm quite sure that the "category formula suddenly shows an error" has been caused by the same bug.

I'll mark this as fixed and you guys let me know if you can still reproduce it with the next IMatch update.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2020, 11:32:10 AM by Mario »

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #26 on: October 11, 2020, 04:32:07 PM »
Thanks Mario this is good news.
It'll take me awhile to know for sure if the bug is fixed or not because the problem occurs so sporadically.  Everything might work fine for a couple weeks and then the problem will happen several times in one day.

sinus

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #27 on: October 12, 2020, 08:22:48 AM »
Thanks Mario this is good news.
It'll take me awhile to know for sure if the bug is fixed or not because the problem occurs so sporadically.  Everything might work fine for a couple weeks and then the problem will happen several times in one day.

The same here. Thanks for that, hopefully it is this, what you find out.
We will see.
Good news  :D
Best wishes from Switzerland! :-)
Markus

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #28 on: November 20, 2020, 04:49:21 PM »
Mario it seems this may still be a problem in version 2020.11.2

Twice yesterday I had formula category errors that were corrected by simply editing the formula but not changing anything.

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #29 on: November 20, 2020, 05:57:13 PM »
Logfile?

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #30 on: November 20, 2020, 07:02:43 PM »
It hasn't happened today yet, I'll attach the logfile the next time it does.

Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #31 on: November 20, 2020, 07:06:47 PM »
Please do. I have added extra logging just for your problem case.

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #32 on: November 21, 2020, 11:35:38 PM »
Ok, I just had 2 formula categories show an error.  I don't see any errors in the logfile but I've zipped and attached it to this message.


Mario

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #33 on: November 22, 2020, 09:03:32 AM »
Interesting. IMatch handled two internal "exceptions" while calculating the "Versions" and "Updated" categories.
An exception indicates that IMatch did something wrong (e.g., accessed an invalid section in memory) while calculating these categories. So there is an issue.

Unfortunately, without having your database in my lab and then running it as long as needed to reproduce this particular problem, there is little I can do.
Furthermore, this may even depend on something specific, like the performance of your system in this time frame, that was just 'right' to cause this exception. Or it depends somehow on the operations you've performed before.

I see you used the Renamer.
Then a lost of searching for tag data was going on, while updating data-driven categories, e.g. '!Checks'.
The category was reported s #SLOW, but that could just be the current situation.

File Relations were updated/checked at the same time. There were also 2,016,650 checks for versions performed.
This took over 20 seconds (!) which is quite slow. Either IMatch was so busy updating data-driven categories at the time, or your file relations are complicated and require a massive amount of operations to update...?

A Metadata Template was also applied.

The 'Checks!' category was updated many times, apparently one or more of the other operations performed invalidated the category continuously, and for an unknown reason the results were immediately required by some other category or user interface element, so the category had to be recalculated right away.

In short, a lot was going on and the database system was almost maxed out. This reduced overall performance.
Collections and data-driven categories were updated. Metadata template applied which invalidates all data-driven categories. So all categories were updated again.
A ton of file relations were updated, either for collections or for the Checks! category. And then the calculation of the Versions and Updated categories failed with an exception.

Are these formula-based categories? Does it use one of the formulas you've already posted? I run all these formulas (and the ones from sinus) in my 200,000 files test database for a long time now, never failed so far, unfortunately.

JohnZeman

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Re: Category-formulas shows errors, but the formula is correct
« Reply #34 on: November 22, 2020, 04:13:56 PM »
Are these formula-based categories? Does it use one of the formulas you've already posted? I run all these formulas (and the ones from sinus) in my 200,000 files test database for a long time now, never failed so far, unfortunately.

Yes, the formula categories that went into error yesterday are the Master images updated today and the Version images updated today categories that I posted up above in this thread last July 16th.

These errors usually occur right after I have reprocessed some old raw images (masters) to improve the end result quality which I then replace my existing JPG versions with.  This is something I do quite often when I have spare time, it's kind of a hobby for me, to keep improving the end result quality of old images.

I can't say for sure that's the only time the errors occur but it seems like it.

My !Checks parent category has 7 formula subcategories that alert me if I forget to fill in some important metadata while entering new images into the database.  However I really don't need those categories now that I have another way of knowing which images have missing metadata so I will be deleting those categories from my database today.

And I think I'll also delete the Master images updated today and the Version images updated today categories since they are redundant for the collections that do the same thing.